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Post by Cyggy on Aug 18, 2022 9:39:32 GMT
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Post by sadako on Aug 19, 2022 10:59:20 GMT
I think he might've been fine if he'd just been a nasty killer mercenary who was slightly ahead of the curve as seen in Resurrection of the Daleks.
The whole business of trying to redeem him in Attack of the Cybermen never really made sense, and just came off as a clumsy bit of author's fiat wanting to suddenly go for a tragic ending (I really do get the sense Saward had just seen Return of the Jedi and was going for a Vader's redemption rip-off).
The main issue is that in that very story, Lytton has already needlessly led innocent men to a death trap to achieve this goal, so it comes across like we're being expected to accept a fake apology that never really acknowledges his evil past deeds and hopes we just go with the moment anyway.
The problem with this era's attempts to convey ideas of nobility amidst villains, and journeys of redemption concerning Turlough, Ictar, Lytton, Orcini, is that it's clear that the writers, Saward imparticular, don't actually have clue what those words mean.
If his tragic end works at all, it's largely because Maurice Colbourne is never less than brilliant in the role and holds together the character despite all the contradictions.
I think the idea of a tragic end might've worked if it was Stein, and if he had survived Resurrection in a confused state, fallen into criminality and then been recruited by the Cybermen only to keep forgetting his original mission/identity, and the Doctor had been cautious of him until the end where it turns out he'd made a promise to the Cryons and had remembered to honour it last minute.
The attempts to do this with a self-willed alpha character like Lytton just feel like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
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Post by profh0011 on May 16, 2024 23:03:42 GMT
The problem with this era's attempts to convey ideas of nobility amidst villains, and journeys of redemption concerning Turlough, Ictar, Lytton, Orcini, is that it's clear that the writers, Saward imparticular, don't actually have clue what those words mean. We were never even sure if Lytton was the original, or a clone of Lytton.
ATTACK... is just a mess. As if RESSURECTION... wasn't already bad enough.
Orcini didn't need a "journey of redemption", in my eyes. He deserved to live at the end of REVELATION..., and I would have liked to have seen him cross paths with The Doctor maybe once a year after that, to contrast 2 very different kinds of "good guys" in the universe. He was my favorite Saward character, and the bastard KILLED him off for no reason, other than that Saward LOVES killing off characters for no reason.
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Post by iank on May 19, 2024 21:05:37 GMT
Great character, though way better in Attack than Resurrection.
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